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My Turn To Attempt The Challenging beating the rust, my progress thread Rate Topic: -----

#1 User is offline   happy-kat 

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Posted 08 April 2009 - 06:09 PM

inspiration needed please mellow.gif

I have all the stuff to rust proof my car's underbody but keep putting of starting as just don't really know how to go about the cleaning bit.

I have a pair of small ramps that I can reverse up, a bottle of anti grease cleaner various brushes and stuff around the place but this hurdle, maybe it is mainly mental, I just can't start the job. Like I feel I will fail so if I don't start I wont therefore fail.

What I am after please is some help to get me going on knowing how to actually go about cleaning the crannies underneath and whether I need to be precious or just put those rubber gloves on and get on with it!
searching is fruitful | I'm a sponge not a mechanic | The Wiki is cool, please do check there if stuck with a Puma problem whilst waiting for a reply | For the Puma fan this read 'The Inside Story Book' is very nice to own link coming soon

#2 User is offline   downhuman 

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Posted 08 April 2009 - 06:16 PM

I'm gonna do my rear arches soon - want a rustproofing buddy??

Lol!

To degrease get hold of some good degreaser and a pressure spray bottle (B&Q do them in the garden section)

Mix it in the appropriate ratio and generously spray over the arches / underside etc etc.

Leave to dwell and pressure wash off if possible - this will help shift any ming too.

Dry (air dry) or use a leaf blower.

Be careful with pressure washers on tyres as they can take out chunks... you should be ok on the underside, especially using detailing brushes and maybe an old mitt (which can then be used for wheels / engine in the future)

I'm doing mine soon so will be in the same place as you!

#3 User is offline   happy-kat 

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Posted 08 April 2009 - 06:49 PM

thank you biggrin.gif
I am OK about doing the arches as I can see these and no need to crawl around, I will do these last, right now it is cleaning the underside huh.gif
I have already a pressure garden bottle, I use it in hose pipe bans if I have to do the car for a show, that is really good idea cool.gif
I bought Surflex so have the degreaser.
I was worried about how much actual using a brush and stuff on the underside. Worried about missing places and also damaging connections and stuff, oh and being under the car ohmy.gif
I think I have to remove the crud first.
Then once dry remove any loose rust, I have a selection of wire brushes for this already that Gary got for jobs he was doing.
I don't have a garden blower, lol our garden is not large enough, if I did have one it would blow dry next door's washing wink.gif so it will need to air dry. So I will leave it a week before I then apply my wax stuff underneath.

Though I am sure you have done this before on other cars biggrin.gif so are well prepared with an army of rubber gloves wink.gif talking of which I have found a fab pair of large and loose black ones that are perfect for working with as they can just drop off the hand when needing to be clean.

This project is really about walking the talk and not just babbling on w00t.gif or even dreaming about it being finished and missing out the doing bit!
searching is fruitful | I'm a sponge not a mechanic | The Wiki is cool, please do check there if stuck with a Puma problem whilst waiting for a reply | For the Puma fan this read 'The Inside Story Book' is very nice to own link coming soon

#4 User is offline   natstick 

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Posted 09 April 2009 - 06:52 PM

I'm in the same boat myself Happy Kat
Got all the bits I need, just waiting for a prolonged spell of dry weather (not that thats likely!)
Might be a little while yet before I get going as it needs to be done all in one go I think.
Good luck and any updates of your progress would inspire the rest of us!

#5 User is offline   shinigami 

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Posted 09 April 2009 - 07:17 PM

Good luck for when you do go for it.
I'm sure that when you get started, that fear of failing will be replaced by a sense of achievment and proudness of your hard work as get get further into it smile.gif

I want to do the same but I will by sorting our old fiesta's rusty patches first, it'll be quite handy to see how it goes before I try the Puma.

I'm going to be trying some of that Deox-Gel from Bilt Hamber, see if it's as good at removing rust as it looks.


FRP = Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!

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#6 User is offline   ssulti 

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Posted 09 April 2009 - 07:54 PM

Happy rust hunting happy-kat. You have seen what untreated rust can do, attack first and be a winner. wink.gif

As my story tells it's tale, too long doing nothing for rust is always a bad thing.

Looking forward to hear your progress, as you have looked after mine. wink.gif


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#7 User is offline   happy-kat 

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Posted 09 April 2009 - 08:00 PM

thanks guys biggrin.gif


QUOTE (shinigami @ Apr 9 2009, 08:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm going to be trying some of that Deox-Gel from Bilt Hamber, see if it's as good at removing rust as it looks.
I have some of this too, though for using that you would also then need their Zinc product to treat the newly cleaned surface before then doing primier and top coat, I just felt for me and what I wanted to do that this was too much. I am going for the protected and stabilised route but wont be as asphetically pleasing as this approach or ssulti's. Though Dymax UB does dry black. I am using Dymax S50 for the inner rear arch seam stuff from the inside.
See all plans but no go wink.gif

searching is fruitful | I'm a sponge not a mechanic | The Wiki is cool, please do check there if stuck with a Puma problem whilst waiting for a reply | For the Puma fan this read 'The Inside Story Book' is very nice to own link coming soon

#8 User is offline   pumarv6 

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Posted 09 April 2009 - 10:29 PM

Pick a small area Kate and work on that first, running through all the stages that you plan to carry out. This will hopefully start building your confidence and identify to you any potential pitfalls that might occur. No doubt you'll manage that okay, so then you pick another area, slightly bigger to move onto next. Before you know it, all the areas will soon come together and you'll realise you're finished. The good thing about turning it into small projects, is that you'll never feel overwhelmed and you can dip in and out as time permits. smile.gif

You have my number, never be afraid to dial it - I have spent many a winter month underneath my FRP.

#9 User is offline   V4FRP 

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Posted 10 April 2009 - 09:04 AM

Kate I've been writing a piece for a while on the work I did on FRUP's underside but have not yet completed it as I struggle to add photos and am a little short of time. To help you however the text I've written so far is set out below:

Cleaning the underside

This is by its very nature a filthy task to undertake but well worthwhile when completed. The work undertaken on FRUP was completed over a number of weeks during last winter and I shall attempt using memory and photographs taken during the project to give some pointers as to how the task was done. I’m sure that others who have undertaken similar work will add their own contributions to this thread.

Lifting the car
To give myself sufficient working space I purchased four thermalite 4” concrete blocks from Wickes DIY store. To ensure even lifting of the car I also used two 2 tonne trolley jacks. Lifting the front wheel onto one block and the rear onto two blocks on the each side of the car in turn allowed enough working space to access the underside on each side of the car. To work under the rear of the car the rear wheels were raised sufficiently to place them onto two blocks on either side of the car the front wheels being left on the ground.

Cleaning and painting
Floor pans – these were worked on and completed for each side of the car in turn. The first and most filthy job was initial cleaning. The whole floor pan from just behind the front wishbones to the rear wheel arch was soaked in Autoglym machine cleaner and vigorously scrubbed with an assortment of cheap scrubbing brushes and kitchen bristle brushes this was repeated three to four times before being pressure washed off. Believe me you get absolutely filthy and soaking wet!! You also have to be particularly careful to remove all the grime in the indentations you find running alongside the transmission or exhaust tunnel. It is worth using a mirror to ensure that all areas have been thoroughly cleaned. If not happy with the initial results the only solution is to repeat the exercise until happy that the underside is clean. I used about a half to three-quarters of a bottle of cleaner, on either side. You should also unclip the handbrake cable and remove the P clips, which are bolted on to ensure all areas are cleaned and subsequently painted.

Leave the car to dry off if possible for a couple of days then check for any rust on scratched underside and clean these down to bare metal kurust, red oxide and primer any areas. Once happy with the cleanliness the area needs to be carefully masked. I found a mixture of newspaper, thin cardboard and my secret weapon of a roll of kitchen foil to be all that was needed other than a lot of patience and an ability to get into positions never dreamt of by a yoga teacher. Once masked the easy part was the spraying of the area using Imperial blue aerosols purchased from Halfords. FRUP was treated to about five coats of paint per side using up about one and a half aerosols per side. I would recommend wearing goggles and a respirator when spraying under the car as it is an extremely inhibiting environment. For a complete job the exhaust system should be dropped off and the heat shields removed to allow cleaning and painting of the transmission tunnel. This was done for me by Brian. The exhaust system can then be sprayed after a good rub down with silver heat resistant paint likewise the heat shields which can be replaced using new clips (finis code ………)

When replacing the handbrake cable the clips should be replaced (finis code ……..) and the P clips thoroughly cleaned before replacing with new bolts (finis code ……….) or repainted bolts.



Underboot area and rear suspension – the rear end was lifted onto two of the concrete blocks on each side. Again the whole area was soaked in machine cleaner thoroughly brushed in and then pressure washed off. The under boot panel was particularly badly rusted and was wire brushed down using a small rotary wire brush on a flexible drive this is again a pretty filthy job. Once cleaned down to the metal the are was sprayed, after suitable masking, with red oxide grey primer and then finished off with Ford Nordic Light Green Metallic no lacquer coat was added. The rear beam axle hubs, shocks (not forgetting to mask the stickers on the shocks) and springs were sprayed with Hammerite smooth black paint and the final job was to use the same black finish on the wheel arches. The amount of time spent masking areas using a mixture of newspaper, cardboard and aluminium cooking foil far out weighs the time spent actually spraying but pays dividends. All plastic areas under the back were then treated to a good coating of back to black to finish off the job.


#10 User is offline   happy-kat 

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Posted 10 April 2009 - 11:27 AM

Many many thanks, that is a superb a lot of meat there Dave biggrin.gif very kind to share it.
I am particularily keen on the cleaning information as my treatment approach is going to be different.
My mechanic is going to be removing my entire exhaust system and I will also ask for my heat shields to be removed and we are going to treat that area whilst on the lifts. I am also going to ask (you never know unless you ask) if he will remove the petrol tank too and do that area too and the back side of the tank.
Thus leaving me the rest of the underside.
I see that I may start this Monday/Sunday weather/energy dependant.
I will take pictures and post how it goes as it goes along.
The stuff I am using is painted on and then left 24 hrs and a second coat applied. It dries back. It is an all in one rust killer and ongoing inhibitor and has some resistance to being hit by road flying objects. It is a wax based product so creeps to when applied.
Lastly I will work around each wheel arch area.
Then it is move onto the interior doors and cavities etc. with my other rust wax product.
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#11 User is offline   shinigami 

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Posted 10 April 2009 - 03:12 PM

Are you planning on removing factory underseal from the bottom of the front half of the car or do you think you will be leaving that alone?
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#12 User is offline   happy-kat 

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Posted 10 April 2009 - 04:13 PM

I am leaving all factory finishes under the car intact including any Ford Direct over spray, if there is rust present I will agetate the surface and remove any loose flakey stuff before applying the wax I have bought
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#13 User is offline   happy-kat 

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Posted 10 April 2009 - 04:33 PM

today was another do it tomorrow jobby wink.gif and instead polished my new exhaust watching the rain!
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#14 User is offline   V4FRP 

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Posted 10 April 2009 - 10:06 PM

Get on with it Kate, unsure.gif honest once you start its infectious, think of it as advanced yoga and you cant go wrong. If other things were not affecting my future mobility I'd come and do it for you myself. rolleyes.gif

#15 User is offline   warrenpenalver 

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Posted 12 April 2009 - 10:06 PM

kate its not THAT bad a job once you get started!! split it into sections, eg each wheel arch, front under engine, passenger floor pan, driver floor pan, under fuel tank, boot floor, rear arches etc and work round each section in turn. SPlitting it up means you can say to yourself "tonight its front drivers arch" etc making it more manageable individual goals to achieve. Obviously you need overlap so when your putting on wax, the section next to it is already clean - you dont want to cover up dirt/rust after all!!!

If you can put it on axle stands then all very well as raised up nicely you can sit on the floor in the arches and get a real good look and get right in there with cleaning brushes etc.

Tank and exhaust off makes life MUCH easier!!!

You can do the job in a few afternoons depending on rust repairs needed and how quick you can work.

I did this on my old fiesta last year just using axle stands:


Mine wasnt particularly neat, but then i didnt intend it to be, but it does serve its purpose!! Youd be surprised how much paints and waxes you can use up once you start finding all those nooks and cranies you didnt realise existed!!! I stripped down all the suspension subframes and rear beams having them powdercoated which is good as they will last longer and also you can treat the mounting areas which you can now see fully. Also means you get to really KNOW the underside of your car which is a good thing!!

This post has been edited by warrenpenalver: 12 April 2009 - 10:08 PM

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#16 User is offline   happy-kat 

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Posted 13 April 2009 - 09:03 AM

thank you Warren that is really helpful too biggrin.gif
I know all about pacing, I do it daily I am just struggling with this job, as you have all said once I start I should feel more confident and then be able to carry on smile.gif
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#17 User is offline   warrenpenalver 

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Posted 13 April 2009 - 01:49 PM

Its something your more than capable of doing kate!! You cant even do any harm really!!

Can you clean with a stiff brush? Check!
Can you get covered in muck lying on your back under a car? Check!
Can you use a paint brush without injuring yourself?? Check!!!

Thats pretty much all there is to it!!

If you find significant rust im sure you can use a wire brush effectively and if welding needs doing youd be using a professional to get that done anyway. So its well within your capabilitys. You just need a swift "boot" in the behind to give you the motivation to do it wink.gif laugh.gif
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#18 User is offline   ssulti 

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Posted 13 April 2009 - 04:09 PM

QUOTE (warrenpenalver @ Apr 13 2009, 04:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Its something your more than capable of doing kate!!


If I'm capable to do, I guess that Kate should also be. I'm very average IT geek with very basic utilities and knowledge about cars - and I'm gone thru 3 months of rust hunting. One week from now and car goes to partial respray. Wire brushing and spraying stuffs to car was easy task, I even managed to do some pro tasks (tin/lead fix on rear corner), but let professional welder to do skirt welding.

Only way to cause harm is if you grind some cables or drop something heavy & hard to your fingers. tongue.gif

Hop in and enjoy the feeling when to-do list start to go shorter and shorter. You will enjoy your drive even more after bit of greasy work done for it. cool.gif

2 weeks from now, hopefully, I'm enjoying sun shine and almost rust free kat... (it will be never 100% rust free after leaving factory)

And if your mirror doesn't get scared when it sees this kind outcome from under the car, go for it!




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#19 User is offline   happy-kat 

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Posted 13 April 2009 - 05:11 PM

yep Warren and ssulti I can quite happily get real dirty biggrin.gif
today I washed my horse's tail and got covered (and soaked) in horse poo!! I think dirty rust sounds more appealing wink.gif
soon I will post a real update good.gif
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#20 User is offline   warrenpenalver 

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Posted 13 April 2009 - 07:11 PM

ssulti, did someone punch your lights out just before that photo??? laugh.gif ohmy.gif
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