[Tyeboi]

I have been speaking to my colleague at work who is a very experienced welder with a history of building roll cages for landrovers but Id like to know what pipes to use on building a small roll cage in my puma. needs to be lightweight but without being majorly expensive?

any ideas?

[pumapilot]

I would PM Turby or 3Dunk for advice.

[philalix]

interested also...wiechers are building roll cages for pumas, different metal and shape quality, depending on the use of the car.

[Tyeboi]

ok well its for road/track day use so will be based around that when balancing budget and quality.

it will be a small roll bar with supports plus rear strut brace for seat belts.

[rallycraig]

I have just had a pair of 6 point bolt in cages with X diagonals and X door bars, belt bars made by a mate of mine in derby who builds cages for a living. very smart cages and very easy on the pocket. I have been rallying for many years and was very impressed by these items.

[philalix]

Craig would be interested by a roll cage built by your friend

[volcomstone411]

custom cages do a puma cage, all cut ready to go. Then you would be able to sell the shell after for good money.

[roadrally]

I fitted a Roll Centre weld in rollcage to my rallycar, it came cut close to length but the ends needed to be profiled.
A weld in cage requires a lot more work, complete stripdown of the interior, including dashboard out.

Tube type depends on the use
Standard type cages are 50mm cold drawn seemless (cds) main hoop, then other tubes are 42mm, 40mm and 38mm cds.
For lighter cages then you need T45 tube (for motorsport regulation) which is a lot more expensive.

This post has been edited by roadrally: 04 November 2010 - 03:02 PM

[Dave2302]

roadrally, on 04 November 2010 - 02:55 PM, said:

Tube type depends on the use
Standard type cages are 50mm cold drawn seemless (cds) main hoop, then other tubes are 42mm, 40mm and 38mm cds.
For lighter cages then you need T45 tube (for motorsport regulation) which is a lot more expensive.

Unfortunately not so any more.....

The only tube acceptable under MSA regs now is either 50mm dia X 2mm wall, or 45mm dia X 2.5mm wall CDS for new build cages. T45 is acceptable but a lot more expensive and you need different wire to weld it. Material spec for T45 is in the Blue book.

If you're building a cage, it must also exactly follow one of the designs in the MSA Blue book.

I'm in the process of building mine ATM and I'm using all 45mm as it is lighter per unit length.

The only way a cage can be made of anything different is if it comes with a certificate, from one of the mainstream cage companies, who have had the stress testing done.

Also, remember, just one small alteration to a certified cage, and then the certification is no longer valid. Example would be adding a rear cross brace for harness mounts.

This post has been edited by Dave2302: 07 November 2010 - 05:10 PM

[Dave2302]

PS, forgot to mention, I've shopped around and the best quote I got for CDS 45mm x 2.5mm is £13.00 per metre.

Also, the only decent way to do this on a Puma is with the dash out, you are not allowed any bends in the lower half of the front lateral bars, i.e. from screen base down.

MSA regs changed and they are getting very hot on cages now, but once you've read and understand the regs, by doing it yourself you will save over half the cost.

Also the mountings for the main hoop and lateral bars are a bit of an arse on the Puma, because they end up above box sections and aren't flat, so you need to make up your own (3mm thick min 120 sq cm), reinforcing plates, with captive nuts to weld to your shell, which the rollcage feet, (3mm plate min 120 sq cm), then bolt to.

Bolt spec is minimum 3 of M8 ISO 8.8, but I've used 4 of M10 ISO 8.8 s per foot, and 2 of on each turret foot

See my project post on here for photo's of how to do the feet, the rear turret ones will be uploaded tommorrow night, but all the others are already on.

HTH Dave

This post has been edited by Dave2302: 07 November 2010 - 05:29 PM

[roadrally]

Had to check this out further because the cage (weld in) fitted to my car has some smaller dia. bars. I bought it in 2001 and I fitted it in 2005 when regs were different, so thought there might be an issue when it comes to logbooking it.
The MSA have told me that the wording is to change in 2012, the current regs do state that only 45 and 50 mm cds/T45 can be used for new cages but this was intended to be for the mandatory bars only and smaller tube for additional braces was to be allowed.
I can wait till 2012 to get mine logbooked within the new regs or I can pay an additional £200 to get a MSA certificate for my cage to be used.

MSA technical regs are a minefield!!!!!!!!!

[Dave2302]

roadrally, on 09 November 2010 - 12:25 PM, said:

MSA technical regs are a minefield!!!!!!!!!

Oh yes !!!! And don't be holding your breath that they won't change it all again between now and 2012

Cheers Dave